USA Today Article on Tight Job Market for Nurses

[reesern1963]

It nailed you as being ageist and thoughtless, that's for sure.

Everyone deserves an opportunity at a job, no matter how old they are. Being young doesn't make someone more capable. That "older" nurse has more experience and wisdom than a young, inexperienced nurse.

You don't know what you don't know. But of course, you know it all. <roll eyes>

[Westcoastrn]

You can only fill so many positions in house, those rns taking those jobs are vacating jobs to do it and you can only run a hospital on so much a skelaton crew.

I know, old people never retire, they just work slow and slow things down. I'll happily retire at 40 from the military and take my check if I stay in that long.

An O-4 with 20 years of active duty service is making about $26 thousand per year in retirement pay with no allowance money for housing or subsistence. If you stay in the national guard, you will make even less and you don't start collecting until you are 60 so what will you live on for 20 years between age 40 and 60?

I don't see you making rank beyond 0-4 because it turns into a political game after that where you need to play well with others and play the game by their rules.

[Gona_bea_nurse]

Normally it's 0-5 people retire at, at least all the retired officers I know (2) got out at that rank. The Army is promoting fast right now. Only takes around 3 years to make captain. If I go active I see no issue making LTC (hopefully). The leader of my NG unit is a nurse. She's over a number of doctors which is awesome.

[Gona_bea_nurse]

A little longer than 2 in the reserves. 42 months of commissioned service before eligibility to be promoted to CPT. Still 3 and half isn't much and your 0-3 with much of your career still to go.

[Westcoastrn]

Those who retire at O-5 are not retiring during year 20. Most officers retiring at year 20 are retiring as O-4.

Maybe a recruiter told you people were making O-3 in two years but it's not the case. If there is an O-3 slot open and no available officer to fill it, they don't just promote someone. They will just plug the hole with an O-2.

I can assure you that no nurse in the military is telling a physician what to do no matter what their rank may be.

[atr320]

A little longer than 2 in the reserves. 42 months of commissioned service before eligibility to be promoted to CPT. Still 3 and half isn't much and your 0-3 with much of your career still to go.

Gona_bea_nurse: I enjoyed reading your posts about the military. I'm an airline pilot (not a nurse), but I spent a number of years on active duty (USAF) and retired in the USAFR while working full-time in commercial aviation. 42 months for 0-3? Things haven't changed much...in my day a 2lt could pin on his 0-3 bars after 3 years unless there were extenuating circumstances....The military isn't the worst option; in my profession many pilots have been furloughed (fired) due to economics and a lot of them were grateful to renter the military more or less full-time...at least it's a paycheck with decent benefits. Let Uncle Sam send you to school, split and consider staying in the reserves if you want to. The USAF paid for my education and I owed them 4 years of active duty (not bad)...I was hired by the airlines right out of the USAF and even though the starting salary was way more than the military paid, I still put in 20+ years in the reserves; it was easy and I got to stay in contact with some military friends (and fly some interesting aircraft). My current F/O (first officer/co-pilot) is a retired USAF O-5, I'm guessing that she's only about 45 years old. I'm sure that nurses can do as well. Best of luck and thanks for your advice on an earlier post.

[Gona_bea_nurse]

I can assure you that no nurse in the military is telling a physician what to do no matter what their rank may be.

if she's commander over the whole unit she is. Not how to do his job but what to do and he has to salute her too. (sexist pronouns replace he/she at will)

[OBNurseJeanne]

if she's commander over the whole unit she is. Not how to do his job but what to do and he has to salute her too. (sexist pronouns replace he/she at will)

This is what is really going to scew you up in life. A person who has been on active duty with 20 years in the reserve tells you how it REALLY is but you--who is a nursing student recently accepted into the Army, not even completing basic training yet--think you know more about Army life than he does.

Someone here has already tried to point out that you don't even know what you don't know.

[Gona_bea_nurse]

You can court martial a lower ranking soldier if he refuses to follow orders, doc or no. You must follow the orders of those who outrank you.

[reesern1963]

This is what is really going to scew you up in life. A person who has been on active duty with 20 years in the reserve tells you how it REALLY is but you--who is a nursing student recently accepted into the Army, not even completing basic training yet--think you know more about Army life than he does.

Someone here has already tried to point out that you don't even know what you don't know.

Give up, Jeanne. It's like talking to a tree stump.

[OBNurseJeanne]

You are right, Reese. I'm done......

[copperrose]

Oh the insistance of youth. I remember new nurses who thought they knew everything there was to know about nursing until they had their first emergency and they fell HARD. Live and learn

[copperrose]

Read a story in the Dallas paper about how many nurses Texas will need by 2025. Many of us old farts will be retiring by then and the #retiring will be ># of new nurses. There may not be positions now but there certainly will be in the future. When the economy is bad, nurses go back to work> few positions open. Whwen the economy is good the nurses stay home or only work part time. I've seen this cycle before and it will come around again sometime I'm sure.

[oldntiredRN]

I say- bravo, kudos, thumbs up and a big thank you to Edson, jeanne, copperrose and reese for standing up to Gonna and speaking the real truth about the current nursing job market. I am an "older" (54 yr old w/30yrs of RN bedside) and no one wants us. I am currently spending my mornings at Unemployment. As I looked around that unemployment room yesterday( an being a nosey old nurse- I observed and listened/easedropped!) I say 85% of the people in that room over 50, mostly women- 3 of us were RN's!!!, 5 were teachers, 1 woman had her masters degree and 1 woman was a copywriter, 2 were men nicely /profesionally dressed who looked totally humillated and embarassed to be there. What are us older nurses to do to support ourselves for 50yrs until we are social security age. we are not confused or demented, we still eat and ambulate independently and are able to hold our bowels and bladder. Gonna- you need to know, 40 is only a VERY short time away from 50- your day will come and you will be the one screaming the loudest- "I'm not old" you are obviously very young in that you don't think it going to happen to you- that's an adolescent mind set. When i was a younger,newer nurse, we worked with many older nurses-50+, we may not have liked them but we did respect them for their experience, and we were smart enough to realize that when that emergency happened @3AM or anytime now when no one was around we knew who to call for guidance and help. A very good and important point was made by Edson- the job postings, hiring internally, hiring freezes. Gonna- the adminsitrations are NOT flattering you young ones, they are infact laughing in your faces. They know you young ones don't know the difference between safe and unsafe, and they are USING you, risking your new licenses and the patient's life, (the one person who you will be TOTALLY responsible for should the least little mistake is made) for the administrative bottom line- money. administration,CEO's are in healthcare to make money, they are not in it for the sake of humanity and good deeds. Ceo's make multimillion $$$ salaries, PLUS bonuses, perks and bene's (their's AND their families healthcare, new mini mansions, luxury cars, of their choice, and bonuses of milions of dollars graduated over the course of so many years IF they show a profit to their stockholders) do you think they are going to keep some little inexperienced nurse around should they screwup because they "were short staffed- 6 postops, 2 admissions, 3 discharges and an RRT or Code, inaddition to calling labs, giving meds, doing assessments, getting screamed at by all for cold food, my IV hurts,this sheet is wet, name calling the nurse, swinging at the nurse"??? and gets the hospital sued- OH,NO!! honey your gone.(check out nursing spectum article on CULLEN's Law) The adminstration is in it to win the money game-" older experienced" nurses in some areas of this country are/were earning $35-44/hr plus their bene's. I know, I was one of them. Younger nurses will and are taking lower salaries$20-25/hr It's nothing to do with how fast you are- it's MONEY, and older nurses see this, and SPEAK-UP. These CEO's want no questioning, challenges or mouth. They want to collect their greedy big salaries, watch their bank accounts get fatter and fatter with no opposition-"Hi, honey I'm home, How's my poopsy today?". When was the last time any one read"CEO cut salary in half-New nurses being hired" CEO's get their salary right of the top- before any one(nurses, hospitalist, lab, x-ray etc) or any thing( lights, water, grounds keeping, landscaping, equipment) gets paid. They do not forego or sacrifice one copper penny. Copperrose is right- this has happened before- in the 1990"s. And Doctors are Not immune to dementia, confusion, brain tumors, alzheimers, MS, Diabetes, stroke, etc that will cause them to leave their practice- I've known quite a few of them in my day also. Don't be shocked Gonna- some have even died- a 42 yr old cardiologist dropped dead at his kitchen table one morning, as did a 42 yr old nephrologist, a 60 yr old oncologist- died of melenoma- I worked with all.

[oldntiredRN]

Gonna- you kind of sound like you are intoxicated by power. That is dangerous(unsafe), especially in Nursing